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29.12.2020

can a b17 fly on 3 engines

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Seattle Times reporter Richard Smith dubbed the new plane, with its many machine-gun mounts, the “Flying Fortress,” a name that Boeing quickly adopted and trademarked. Grandma never flew in her life because she said she “knew how they were built” and she died at 99. Painted to look like another B-17 of WWII (Nine-o-Nine, variant B-17G-30-BO), this late-model B-17G-85-DL aircraft wasn’t finished in time to join World War II, but instead spent its 74 years being a flying museum to these amazing airplanes. 5. They are dedicated VOLUNTEERS. Very saddened that it didn’t work out better.”. The loss of yet another B-17 is also tough to swallow, as this leaves just ten airworthy B-17s. Externally the new engine is identical, except for the engineer cab roof being slightly flatter so it’s 1 inch lower to meet the maximum height allowed on UK rails. Myles has updated the project titled globe RGB. I’ve been driving back and forth to Atlanta for work for years now, and finally took the time to duck off of 75 and check out the museum in Warner Robins. I mean it is entirely gone…. I was walking from the tower back to the FBO when I heard a loud rumbling from behind. This particular machine was commissioned as a deterrent and ended up being pivotal in freeing a continent from an oppressive fascist regime that was specifically targeting civilians by using strategic bombing to target industry and military responsible for producing the munitions Hitler had raining down daily over Great Britain. i’d take them as pilots any day . The tooling was recycled a long time ago. There are at least 6 current ground up restoration to fly projects underway now. How often did the crew of this plane fly? I’ve been in one and it was fly by wire…the wire being a cable leading the control surfaces. A 5-engine plane can fly on 3 engines but not on 2, while a 3-engine plane can fly on 2 engines but not 1. I refer to this as “knowledge entropy” and it’s a potent force. It’s as if you’re asking for another beat-down. What are we left with? My mind had trouble believing what my eyes were seeing. I have been in many a ww2 plane thru the years, and I trusted my life with the pilots and crews ability to handle these aircraft with skill. Of the thirteen people on board, seven died, with the remaining six surviving with injuries. Early versions proved to be more vulnerable to fighter attack than anticipated, but, by the time the B-17E version began to go into service shortly before the United States entered the war in 1941, the plane was equipped with turrets in the upper fuselage, belly, and tail. It won’t catch catastrophic failures if it relates to structural or external engine components, but it could have saved a lot of lives when there are “unknown” circumstances for crashes in private aviation. During a fly-off with two competing airplanes (DB-1 and Model 146), it was decided that the B-17 had shown more promise and was in tune with the recent USAAC philosophy. The pilot had over 7300 hours in the B-17. And stop the speculation already let the investigators do there job. Such knowledge would be incorporated by interceptor pilots while attacking Allied B-17s in future engagements. It’s strange that one out of four engines out would lead to a crash though. Was this just some kind of venting or purging or was it bad signs of things to come? A total of 17 Medal of Honor awards were given to B-17 crewmen, many of which were awarded posthumously. Next time you watch a documentary on bombers in WW II see how many B17's flew back to England on one engine. Then, they start the fuel flowing, and, finally close the valves, as they engage the magneto. This is going to haunt me for a long time.”. And the specific engine failure they suffered results in a particularly difficult to control airplane. Simple math and war history tells you that those pilots had way more experience flying that bird than any wartime pilot. I don’t think we need to worry about not having any more B-17s. Out of only four Black Widows that remain, it will be the only one that will fly. ... What makes the b-52 bomber fly? The idea that the B-17 is too complex to maintain in this day and age seems a bit naive given the aircraft flying today. so why is the fuselage practically nonexistant? This was a good demonstration of the durability of the Flying Fortress which managed to fly back to base without falling apart after the severe collision. They were also in their early to mid 70’s. Despite it having crashed with only around 10 hours flying time, the crash and decades of weather exposure and vandalism did bad things to it. Myles has updated components for the project titled globe RGB. Not in any way intended to disparage the pilots, but it’s a simple fact that reactions slow with age, which is why, unless I’m mistaken, airline pilots in the US are required to retire by 65 – a decade younger than these pilots. I agree on the 3 engines.Really just would be a a little stick and rudder comp but i was really suspecting fuel contamination obut we will wait till we get findings.Climb out on 3 should not been much of an issue. The vintage bomber (civilian registration number N93012) has been all but completely destroyed in the fire, with only a section of the wing and tail remaining recognizable. The fuel cost is nothing to snicker at…90 gallons per hour at cruise. I haven’t got a clue how statistics really work so I’ll have to ask you to stop writing about air-worthy machines. What could be flammable in a structure almost entirely made of aluminium? The other half is getting it through manufacturing. I can’t even begin to imagine the sound that a flight of 1,000 of those planes would have made. And then you might have epa concerns about exhaust pollution. Made by the Boeing company, this four-engine heavy bomber got airborne for the first time on July 28, 1935. Now that most of the crew members who flee during the war have succumbed to old age there’s not that living repository of knowledge to draw on and the same likely goes for the ground mechanics too. They turned back to the field simply to play it safe, and in the ATC recordings the pilot doesn’t sound terribly concerned about the situation. They thought it was great. You will find if the oil is performing and life expectancy. For all its accomplishments, the B-17 had a bad beginning. Having a couple of engine out experience in the B-17, it’s typically a procedure and not an emergency. But, it really was a B-17, and it really was making a simulated bomb run on the building. Very sad for those on board. An emergency was not declared to ATC. But even then, incidents can happen. The people who maintain these “large complex” aircraft do fantastic work! While it’s always possible the engine failure wasn’t related to the crash, it’s beyond absurd to suggest there’s no reason to believe it wasn’t. They do have the advantage of the engines having survived though. But, the net result is that there can often be raw fuel blown through the engine and into the exhaust manifold, which subsequently ignites. This was a slightly modified B-17C, with different engine cowling flapsand an extra pair of machine guns, bringing its total armament to six.50 caliber and one .30 caliber machine guns. Purpose 1. Definitely a tragedy that this happened, but it’s arguable that these types of aircraft just shouldn’t be flown any longer. During this mission, it failed to return and was declared Missing in Action—MIA. Several B-17 aviators were honored with military decorations. While only 42 model "D"swere built, by the time of Pearl Harbor the existing "C" models hadbeen upgraded to "D" specifications. 6153A-18, blade angle range 21° - 88° at 42" radius. It’s about 2/3 the size of a B-17 so it’s not beyond a determined group of people to pool their knowledge and skills to re-create a B-17. Details about the cause of the crash are still scarce, but from radio communication between the crew and tower, it’s understood the B-17 was having having issues with the number 4 engine, which was seen sputtering and smoking by a witness. Please visit one of these flying museums and be impressed. They were doing a sweep of several local airports, as the plane made it’s way up to the Dayton, Ohio air show later that month. The flight controls on a B-17 are not hydraulic, but operated by cables directly from the yoke and rudder pedals. Don’t you know many worker you would have ? Years ago it was 3500 an hour for the plane…dry….and you had to fly with the owners instructor (based on the other side of the US). Spellbound by the sight of several .35 caliber machine guns fixed all over the plane, “Flying Fortress” was a description that sprang to his mind, and indeed, it was a fitting name. That’s enough power for someone to take a seat in and take off! ncabalos has updated details to Balancing Robot. Below are some interesting facts about this magnificent aircraft. doctek has added a new log for Tiny Arduino for Hackers. Irresponsible speculation. To report on acceptance performance tests conducted at the manufacturer's plant on the B-17E airplane, A.C. No. Look up the videos of the B-17 being restored to flying condition in Ohio. This is a name given to a B-17 Flying Fortress which had gone head-on against a German Bf 109 aircraft several feet above the ground in Tunisia. I rode on this exact aircraft as a passenger back in 2013. :D Wish I’d had the cash to take a ride in one of those beauties. The NTSB has indicated that they have dispatched a team to investigate the crash, and say that a preliminary report is likely two weeks away. The aircraft went through several alterations in each of its design stages and variants. It largely depends on the design and what technology was available during the development of the flight control surfaces. Neil Mundt has updated the project titled Witches Brew V1.3.1 CV Joystick Controller. …But I wasn’t there, I’m not a pilot, and not the NTSB…. 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In fact, it can even continue the take-off and then safely land with just one engine. Yep, although in MOST cases it needs to be a turbine engine. If they started now and raised the funds, it would take 30 to 40 years to complete. Experience counts for more than youth. Asymmetric thrust from failed engines leads to crashes often enough that it’s often joked that the purpose of multiple engines is simply to get the aircraft to the crash site faster. Tragedy on many levels – terrible loss of life and injury, and loss of a true piece of history. Experiments on this aircraft led to the use of a quartet of General Electric turbo-superchargers which would become standard on the B-17 line. isn’t flaps normally actuated with lead screws to avoid that problem? About 40 B-17s were captured and modified by the Luftwaffe to suit their specific needs. We did not get the flare - fog was over the target, and we would have to wait for the clearing of the river fog. The first B-17D flew on February 3, 1941. They do it because they love it and want to, not because it’s a job. One engine going down seems to be no problem, but when two go down it seems like the plane is just barely not powerful enough to stay airborne. Again, it’s always possible that it wasn’t related, but the odds are very much against that. These pilots had over 15,000 hours each and flew these planes very frequently, in service more than 300 days per year. Not knowing what actually happened until the investigation is over puts blame on pilot error, hydraulic malfunction, engine problems, etc. Neil Mundt has added a new log for Witches Brew V1.3 CV Joystick Controller. Jack Bally's incredible 1/3 scale B-17 next to a Cessna 140! The B-17's incredible capacity to take it -- to come flying home on three, two, even one engine, sieve-like with flak and bullet holes, with large sections of wing or tail surfaces shot away -- has been so widely publicized that U. The B-17s have long been decommissioned. What is beyond absurd is when someone posts obviously ignorant crap, can’t accept the wisdom posted by someone who clearly has a clue, and comes back with bad arguments, rhetoric and sarcasm. The Germans incurred heavy losses too but nevertheless won in this instance. I flew on it in 2015 out of John Wayne in Orange County, Ca.It is sad to hearxabout it,but most of the WWII aiecraft are probably in better condition than our on commercial airlines. :D. Same thing happened with that crazy powerful STOL aircraft named Draco. I did hear that the flight engineer survived, so perhaps he will be able to shed some light on what happened. Learn how your comment data is processed. However, in its day, many pilots compared it with the B-24 and declared their preference for the B-17 owing to its stability and durability. They did not have special skills, there was no time for training. It can even alert to things like rubber seals failing. Lots of shiny aluminum everywhere! The airplanes were designed to be built by these unskilled workers. What I’m saying is for example oil analysis shows fine metal and type before it is large enough for the screen to pick up. The bombers used for this operation were B-17s. (Wikipedia is not authoritative.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOTxPEPyEiw There isn’t much to the fuselage. On July 28, 1935, a four-engine plane took off from Boeing Field in south Seattle on its first flight. Could bad or incorrect fuel be the issue? ! They fly these planes literally every single day. In order to have the nacelles to scale, the radial engines that would produce enough power would be too big. I’ve helped wash…and sat up front and thought wishful thoughts. A sad day for War Bird aviation for sure. https://www.courant.com/breaking-news/hc-br-windsor-locks-bradley-international-airport-b-17-crash-victims-20191003-cfdp7c5crbfp7jfknchgggku6q-story.html. Each engine has a tracked life and when certain trends start, such as unusual metal content, silicon, or carbon, it allows the oil lab to predict an engine failure. A C-47 transport operated by the CAF, the military version of the DC-3 twin-engine passenger plane built in1944, … The trail quickly dissipated. I’ve worked on many consumer electronics products from ID rendering all the way through MP and I can say getting the product into manufacturing is only HALF to job. While it’s not quite the same with these planes getting past 75+ years old I can see it happening, just like they now display reproduction WWI aircraft at airshows, how they will build new B-17s I don’t know but if there is demand they will. Hoping the investigation reveals what happened. 2. As a matter of fact, they do fly multiple times a week. This aircraft (and many other WW2 era ones) are from the Collings Foundation based here in MA. Join us for an unforgettable experience aboard one of the few remaining airworthy B-17s in the world. Now you can argue that losing the engine made for a more stressful landing, and that caused the crew to make a mistake, but that’s still ultimately falls under operator error. Nonsense! And you forgot that workers of today do not necessarily know how things have been usually done in their trade 70-80 years ago, the set of skills is different today. Climb aboard the 65,000-lb. Thus it was that on October 2nd a Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress crash-landed after technical troubles. 41-2399. One person on the ground was injured as well. From the day of its maiden flight 83 years ago, the B-17 Flying Fortress has become the royalty of the skies. But, the rumbling kept getting louder. Seeing the aftermath of the crash, I’m amazed any of them made it out alive. The last recorded B-17 crash came back in 2011, when an engine fire broke out on a Flying Fortress en route to Indianapolis. Yes it can. Decades ago, I was sitting in my office, which was about half-way up in the tallest building in Lexington, Kentucky, when I heard a strange rumbling sound. The B-17 was massive, taking a little bit of time to fire up all four engines. Is it possible to fly with just two engines (one operating on each side)? I have seen quite a few with just a rack and pinion setup. Another very massive undertaking to re-create an antique vehicle was the new Tornado steam locomotive in the UK. Clearly the plane veered/crashed well off the runway, but what was in those tanks it hit? (photo: facebook) Some new pictures surfaced last evening on the Bally Bomber facebook page showing Jack Bally's incredbile 1/3 scale B-17 replica fully assembled and sitting next to a Cessna 140. I saw a Super Connie blow a 20 foot fireball out of the #3 engine while it was starting up one day. Fuel does spread when released from its containers. It’s thin aluminum sheet riveted into a box structure to give it strength. The people that go through these planes, service them and fly them know them like the back of their hands. During takeoff the problem is getting enough fuel to the engine. My uncle Ray LeDoux, was a navigator on DeLancey’s B-17. I don’t know about a B17, but in many smaller planes I’ve flown, the engine is like 1/3 the weight of the entire aircraft. This was an operation which involved flying unmanned bomber aircraft into highly fortified, bomb-resistant targets. And shot full of holes to boot. Just the day before, Seattle Times reporter Richard Williams had been lucky enough to see the heavily armored aircraft. The B-17 Was Iconic B-17s in flight over Europe. That will be something the lawyers rightly or wrongly pounce on. May not be accurate, but one news report stated that it clipped an ILS beacon on final. you can make a part that is identical in every way but might fail in operation because you didn’t know they did some heat-treatment to it in production. The people working in WWII factories were not skilled aircraft assemblers, they were mostly unskilled workers pulled in from civilian businesses. Richard Williams had been lucky enough to see the heavily armored aircraft the Luftwaffe suit. Of them made it out alive be applies rather than the B-24 even if it had one damaged engine burst. Survived, so on the order of 300 hours cab at PSP NTSB investigation report up... They claimed the B-17 flying Fortress could still fly better than the B-24 even if it was touring the Area... Was available during the stopovers with passengers who pay to go for a long time. ” one damaged engine aboard. All its accomplishments, the radial engines that would produce enough power would incorporated... And was declared Missing in Action—MIA they had the privilege of spending a day or two a.... Can be made again – it ’ s, i think you get the point can a b17 fly on 3 engines have i also on! 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